The Word's
Very First Transgender Support Web Site
The Microsoft
Network
Sexuality Forum
July 26th, 1996
A Chat with
Melanie
The Sexuality Forum
Compilation copyright (c) 1996,
msn.
All rights reserved.
MSN Policy:
You may distribute this file freely
provided that you do not modify the
contents of this file in any way.
Host Dunc_FmExec:
Welcome to a chat with Melanie! You will need two
windows open to participate. This room is READ ONLY. Go to Melanies
Chatroom (go word MELANIE) and you can ask questions there as well as
talk to the other members. We will open this chatroom at the end for all
to participate in!
Host Dunc_FmExec:
Hi Melanie and WELCOME to the Sexuality Forum!
Haven't talked face to face with you in a couple of years and it's our
pleasure for you to be here tonight!
Melaniexx:
Thanks, Dunc! It's great to be here!
Host Dunc_FmExec:
Tell us a little about yourself and what you're up
to now! <G>
Melaniexx:
Well, let's see....
First of all, I am the co-creator of the a new
theory of story, the theory of Mental Relativity, I'm married with two
kids, I publish the web magazine, The Subversive, and I had sex change
surgery a little over four years ago.
How's that for a start?
Host Dunc_FmExec:
It's a start for sure! <G>
Host Dunc_FmExec:
Mental Relativity... what is it?
Melaniexx:
Mental Relativity is a new theory of mind. The
major concepts are that the minds of men and women are different, due to
the way they handle space and time. This grows from a hormone wash that
occurs before birth. We've built a math model of the process.
Which areas interest you the most?
Host Dunc_FmExec:
To me, the biggest point is the differences in the
sexes.
Melaniexx:
Let me cover a little bit about how that
happens... In the twelfth to fourteenth week of pregnancy, the brain of
the developing fetus recieves a wash of testosterone or estrogen.
Testosterone enhances the production of the neurotransmitter, Seratonin,
which makes the neurology more powerful, compared to the biochemistry.
Girl babies get a wash of estrogen, which inhibits the neurology, making
the biochemistry more powerful by comparison.
After two weeks, the wash goes away, but it has
had an effect on the cells in the brain that make neurotransmitters...
Boy babies will ALWAYS be biased toward the Seratonin, and hence the
linear, spatial neurology, whereas girl babies will ALWAYS be biased
toward Dopamine, which favors the holistic, temporal (time based)
biochemistry.
Biochemistry is like a big hologram. It contains
interference patterns that hold much more information than the neural
networks of the mind. It is where our emotion, intuition, and creativity
come from, whereas our ability to reason comes from the neurology (the
neurons and ganglia, which are neural networks. All your experiences in
life, can shift the bias a little, but you can never change it from
linear to holistic or vice versa.
>melanie takes a breath!<
Host Dunc_FmExec:
Even hurt my fingers! <G>
Melaniexx:
Stubs!
Host Dunc_FmExec:
What is this story theory?
Melaniexx:
It sees every complete story as an analogy to a
single human mind, trying to deal with an inequity. In fact, the notion
of a male mental sex or female mental sex main character, is essential
to working out the mechanism of a story.
The Theory was implemented as software, which has
now sold over 15,000 copies world wide in only two years. Writers all
over are using it to "predict" what is needed to complete
their stories.
It is the model of Mental Relativity that drives
the Story Engine in the software.
Host Dunc_FmExec:
That's interesting!
Melaniexx:
It took fifteen years to develop at a cost of over
one million dollars. We've lectured at MIT, and I'll be teaching an
eight week course in the theory at UCLA next January. Best of all, it
makes writing HARDER, so the stories come out better.
Host Dunc_FmExec:
Big stuff! It has it's own WWW page too doesn't
it?
Melaniexx:
Yes, while I was working there developing the
theory and software, I set up a WWW site for them. This, of course, was
after I cut my teeth setting up my own web site.
Host Dunc_FmExec:
Your web stuff is some of the best out there!
Great job! What is the URL so everyone can find it?
Melaniexx:
You can reach the web site at http://www.well.com/user/dramatic,
by the way.
My page is at http://www.well.com/user/melanie/
Lot's of good stuff - embedded video, audio, real audio, pictures,
articles, The Subversive, my personal diary, tons of stuff! I have about
16 meg up there right now, all state of the art, cutting edge stuff.
Host Dunc_FmExec:
Very good stuff I might add. :)
Melaniexx:
I get about 400 visitors a day right now, with
about 20,000 accesses per day to my files.
Host Dunc_FmExec:
I'm usually one of those! <G>
Melaniexx:
I think you account for half of them!
Host Dunc_FmExec:
Not quite half I don't think! :D
Melaniexx:
Well, it's a fun site, with something for
everyone,
Host Dunc_FmExec:
We have a few member questions for ya...
Melaniexx:
even a few bikini pictures of moi.
Host Dunc_FmExec:
Yes it is!
Melaniexx:
Shoot!
Host Dunc_FmExec:
Saw that too! <G>
Host NeuroDom:
Dragon-Rdr would like to know:
i'd like an overview of the math model. How did
you arrive at this theory?
Melaniexx:
Well, since it took fifteen years to develop, this
answer is going to be a little less than complete! But, here goes... As
it turns out, our big inspiration was that a story represented one,
single mind.
Because of that, characters, plot, theme, and
genre, were all just different families of consideration the Story Mind
makes, when trying to solve a problem.
In short, it is a model of our own psychology.
Underneath all the storytelling is a deep structure. The deep structure
represents the way all of our minds work the same way.
The storytelling is like our individual
personalities. When you strip away the storytelling and look at the deep
structure, it looks a lot like a Rubik's cube, crossed with a periodic
table of story elements.
We had to model this using non-linear equations,
fractals, relativistic equations, and even a new kind of realm we had to
coin a term for, because we invented the concept, called "frictals"
(for friction and fraction).
In the end, we built a model of the way the mind
moves from one consideration to the next, in the attempt to balance
something that is unbalanced, and we also discovered the concept of
mental sex along the way.
Hope that answers it in brief.
Next?
Host NeuroDom:
gardengal:
How has the period of time been narrowed down to a
finite 2 weeks?
Melaniexx:
Actually, that research was not done by us, but is
an accepted period of time, based on actual testing before birth. A lot
of new information about hormones, sexuality, and the womb is coming
out, and the pre-birth hormone wash is well documented.
It comes and goes like a wave on the sand, leaves
its mark and then recedes, so there is no remaining trace in the brain,
but the minds of men and women forever remain different.
Next?
Host LordandLadyDom_Asst:
and a question from dashing-frisky:
So the hormone wash is an actual physiological
event?
Melaniexx:
Yes, it occurs in all of us. Then, at puberty, we
get a second wash that continues through our adult lives... As children,
we need only a little bias to the space or time side, but if we are two
biased, we end up not being very good at survival, because we don't see
the other side very well at all.
So, at puberty, reproductive age, we get a bias
that moves us completely to one side or the other, and at the same time
generates secondary sexual characteristics, that attract us to a
"bonded pair" with the opposite mentality, so that we end up
seeing more deeply into our side than the other sex, but have a second
half to watch our backs, because they see more clearly right into our
blind side, and us into theirs. This makes a much more viable survival
pair than a single, balanced individual.
Host LordandLadyDom_Asst:
5. Dragon-Rdr:
and, more importantly, how sexuality determines
thinking styles
Melaniexx:
Well, that's a big question, but here's the short
version... Because of the hormone wash before birth, followed by the
hormones at puberty, men see the spatial, linear, binary world more
clearly, but are kinda fuzzy on the whole time/emotion/spectrum/holistic
thing.
Women, of course, are the reverse, seeing much
better, and more clearly the emotional side, the holistic side, and not
being intrinsically as clear on the binary.
This is why women do poorly at higher math, not
because they can't do the math, but the whole language of math is
binary, built by men, and by the time you get to higher math, you are
right in a woman's backyard of thinking, but she has to come at it the
long way around from the binary men's side. We need a second language of
math, science, culture, religion, even language itself, to compliment
the way a woman thinks.
So, men are good at parallel parking, and women
are better at relationships, though that is only about one fourth of
what drives a mind, the rest is training, cultural indrocrination, and
conscious choice.
Host NeuroDom:
gardengal would like to know:
when did you realize that you were different and
was that what began your search?
Melaniexx:
I first realized I was "different" when
I started kindergarten. I just couldn't relate to the "other
boys". I didn't think like that at all. I had to try and learn how
they acted by watching them, but it never came naturally for me. I used
to honestly think my parents didn't love me, because there was something
about being a boy they were supposed to teach me, and they didn't.
I had fantasies of being a girl all my life. But I
thought they were just fantasies. So, after puberty, I put them aside
and got married and had kids and a career. None of that brought me the
fulfillment I was looking for. So, after about 14 years of marriage, I
decided to explore my fantasy, and it turned out it was reality.
Next ?
Host MikeH_Asst:
tasdev: do you think that with the power sharing
and equality of the sexes that this is bringing male and female
sexuality closer and the differences are receding
Melaniexx:
Since I believe the differences are biologic,
<short delay>
I got boffed off the system!
Host Dunc_FmExec:
The moof monster! <G>
Melaniexx:
Okay, as I was saying....
What's happening today is, that society set up
roles that were great for truly binary sexual minds. But, when we
stopped being a survival society, we ended up having more people born
with less of a biochemical bias, this happens naturally.
Originally, only the binary pairs of men and women
could survive best in the wild because they each saw deeper into the
spatial side or temporal side - the way things are or where they are
headed, but as we drifted from survival, more people born in the middle
survived, straightening out the inverse bell curve, making us have a
larger population of men who are more toward the temporal, and women who
are more toward the spatial, but men will never cross that line, nor
women either, they will just meet in the middle through natural
selection. Even now, the testosterone level of men is dropping at 25%
per generation, and women are getting an inch taller per generation.
The problem is, as more of the population gets
toward the middle, there are fewer people who are satisfied with the
rigid roles. But society is a STRUCTURE, which means it cannot change,
but must be dismantled and rebuilt. That takes time, but the changes in
our biologic population are going much faster.
So, those men more toward the temporal, become
cross dressers, because they think more like women insofar as they are
attracted by the role, and women more toward the middle become
feminists, because they think more in the binary, and want the same
benefits and opportunities. In fact, some women and men fit at the ends
of the spectrum in the traditional roles and others belong on the other
side.
Next ?
Host NeuroDom:
Dragon-Rdr asks:
how does this theory affect issues of
homosexuality?
Melaniexx:
Homosexuality is not simply one thing. Part of it
is hormonal, and part of it is experience. In fact, my partner in
creating the theory is gay. As you know, the Corpus Collosum (the
connective band of neurons between the lobes of the brain, is larger in
women and homosexuals, than in straight men. But I have a theory, that
it starts out the same size in both men and women, but grows to
accommodate the kind of thinking an individual does. If it is more
holistic, the two sides need to talk more, if it is more binary, one
side talks, then the other.
So, for gays, I suspect their hormone wash puts
them closer to the middle, so regardless if they learn to be macho or
fey, their intrinsic manner of thinking will cause slow brain changes to
make the band of neurons more holistic.
But, remember, the hormone wash does NOT determine
masculine or feminine, Gay or Straight, or even male or female, but only
linear or holistic.
Next ?
Host LordandLadyDom_Asst:
8. Dragon_rdr: how does this theory affect issues
of homosexuality?
Melaniexx:
Well, I think I pretty much covered that, but
socially, politically? Well, it means that the tendency toward
homosexuality is inborn, but the practice comes from life experience,
cultural indoctrination, etc.
The real question is, if someone has a very real
tendency they can't do anything about, is if fair to ask them to live
miserably, never being true to themselves, or is better to let them
follow their inner yearnings?
In survival societies, you have to kill people
like that to protect the structure, In today's society, you have to let
them go their own way to keep society alive.
Next?
Host MikeH_Asst:
Dragon-Rdr:
what a depressing thought (that we will meet in he
middle) some of us have a great appreciation for polarity
Melaniexx:
Actually, I sympathize, you see I am WAY over to
the female, feminine side myself. But the way I see it, we aren't going
to be from being bi-polar to all the same, but rather, we will become a
complete spectrum with just as many people at any point along the
spectrum as there are at both ends. A rainbow, if you will.
Next?
Host NeuroDom:
dashing-frisky inquires:
Do they know what triggers the hormone wash?
Melaniexx:
No they don't, but we have a hunch in our
theory... Today, DNA is looked at as a structure only, (a typically
male-science point of view) In fact, we believe that is only HALF what
it is, the other half being DYNAMICS.
It is the Dynamics that "trigger" all
aspects of growth, aging, and even the hormone wash. So, the trick will
be to create a Quad helix, instead of a Double helix, and look at the
intangible temporal processes of DNA as part of the whole model. Then,
you can pinpoint when something will happen, and with the first two
spirals, you can tell where.
For transsexuals, however, it is thought that
certain chemicals, can have an impact on when and how long the wash
occurs.
Next?
Host LordandLadyDom_Asst:
13. sweetlayde:
what is the difference between being gay and being
a TS?
Melaniexx:
Sometimes no difference at all. Sometimes a
complete difference. Being transsexual, means being born with a mind
that works like a MAC in the body that is supposed to be IBM. That has
nothing to do with the kind of programs you want to run, only the
operating system. We call the male system, the SBOS for Spatial Brain
Operating System And female is TBOS Temporal Brain Operating System.
When you are born, you think like a boy or a girl
but as you grow up, you learn to like one sex more than the other
physically.
The four aspects of human sexuality are:
Gender Identity (masculine or feminine)
Sexual preference (Straight, Gay, Bi, or Neither -
self)
Mental Sex (male or female)
And anatomical sex (male or female)
Any combination goes. So, a TS might have surgery
and want to be with men, women, both, or neither-self.
Next ?
Host NeuroDom:
_tkjanes wants to know:
do hormones cause marital problems later in life?
Melaniexx:
Well, it's kinda hard to get it up these days...
;) Actually, Mary and I are still married. It has been four and a half
years since surgery, but we have become close friends instead of lovers.
I date for more intimate relationships. My kids rate my boyfriends. Mary
and I sleep in separate rooms, but share the house and the duties.
Next?
Host NeuroDom:
ZZ_THE_CRAB:
Is Melanie talking about ostracism?
Melaniexx:
Osctacism in regard to? Probably an earlier
topic....
Host NeuroDom:
Yes, it was an earlier comment, melanie...
Host Dunc_FmExec:
Yes mam! <G>
Melaniexx:
Perhaps when I mentioned that a survival society
had to kill gays, but a modern society had to elevate them. Well, no, I
mean it actually had to kill them in those days for its own good. There
were so few resources to go around, that they couldn't be wasted on
non-reproductive members. That is why they left the old out to die.
But, I'm not saying that is a wonderful thing. I'm
simply saying that is the way a binary, structured society works...
It carries over into all kinds of remnant
prejudices that are not at all necessary and actually counterproductive
to the growth of society today, so in effect, these kinds of things cut
society's own throat in this day and age.
Next?
Host NeuroDom:
furry asks:
so what's a typical male point of view please
qualify statement
Melaniexx:
Well, remember that any human being is 25% hormone
wash,
25% cultural indoctrination (sub-conscious)
25% education (memory)
and 25% free will (conscious choice)
So, the Mental Relativity theory can only predict
what a typical hormone wash response is, So that statistically you can
see these trends in the population, but for any individual, the other
75% may move them completely to the other side in response,
But typically, a male tends to think logistically,
tends to see things in black and white,
tends to divide a job into steps,
tends to set goals
tends to put off immediate pleasures for
achievements
tends to not notice bad working conditions if
motivated toward a goal
tends to have little patience for anything he
cannot see as being important to himself.
And so on.
But those, of course, are just underlying
tendencies.
Next?
Host LordandLadyDom_Asst:
dashing-frisky asks :
With the changing of society, are we progressing
or regressing?
Host MikeH_Asst:
So is what Melanie is saying is that a post op TS
may be gay AFTER operation? i.e. male before op, female after op but
lesbian?
Melaniexx:
Ah, two questions, one stone...
Host Dunc_FmExec:
hehe
Melaniexx:
As society changes, it opens more options for all
of us so that no matter where we fall in the spectrum or how we change
our outward appearance we can still enjoy relationships of any kind that
attract us.
In fact, most people are not Straight, Gay, Bi or
neither all the time, Just as you wear one kind of clothes to the office
and another to the beach, we drift in and out of how much we are
attracted to which sex.
If we see a particular kind of person, we may be
attracted a lot one day, a little the next, or even repelled. And, even
the context in which we meet them we may change our feelings because of
the atmosphere. Look at prison!
Next?
Host LordandLadyDom_Asst:
dashing-frisky:
With the changing of society, are we progressing
or regressing?
Melaniexx:
Well, we're just changing. There is no progressing
or regressing except from a determined point of view. Each of us needs
to make a value judgment on that from where we stand. But one thing is
for sure,
Host Dunc_FmExec:
This is the last question. We will be opening the
room up for general discussion shortly! :)
Melaniexx:
change will continue or the whole wonderful game
will come to an end.
Was that the last, or is the next the last
(or the last the next?)
Host Dunc_FmExec:
That was the last. :)
Melaniexx:
Dude!
Host NeuroDom:
*|\|euroDom applauds Melanie... thanks for coming!
Dragon-Rdr:
wow
sweetlayde:
mmmm much better
Melaniexx:
Throw the speaker to the lions!
Host NeuroDom:
Thanks for coming, Melanie!
Host Dunc_FmExec:
Floor is open! <G>
dashing-frisky:
that was different
Melaniexx:
My pleasure!
TWO1287:
Oh that feels good now
Dragon-Rdr:
so can you characterize feminine thinking as you
did masculine?
Melaniexx:
Sure (and you can get a lot more on my web site at
http://www.well.com/user/melanie/
Women look toward the over view,
they see things in shades of gray,
they tend to think in feelings
they have a less refined sense of the linear,
putting contentment on hold to achieve a goal
requires a justification.
Women see time as flexible or "subjective
time"
dashing-frisky:
I like your theory adds a lot of logic to
relationships
Melaniexx:
Women select directions rather than steps.
dashing-frisky:
and sexuality
Melaniexx:
Well, it's fun to ponder, anyway.
dashing-frisky:
The physiological connection makes sense to me
Host Dunc_FmExec:
I think it's all very interesting Melanie!
Dragon-Rdr:
i love your theory
Melaniexx:
It's interested me for quite some time. Now, if I
could only get a life!
dashing-frisky:
lol
Host Dunc_FmExec:
I now know a little more about why I like watching
a woman walk down the street anyway, I THINK! <G>
Melaniexx:
Thanks, Dragon. That was a true blessing to work
on.
Dragon-Rdr:
i study theology and it has a lot of implications
in biblical interpretation. i have to give this a lot of thought
Melaniexx:
I'd rather the theories made people think than
made them converts.
The more consideration it stirs up, the more
others will discover about themselves, and that's the best it can do.
Dragon-Rdr:
that is all you can ever hope to do
Melaniexx:
Actually, I hope for a Ferrari.
dashing-frisky:
I must go, thanks Melanie. Could I have your Web
Site address again?
Dragon-Rdr:
naw, definitely a lexus <g>
Melaniexx:
Sure:
http://www.well.com/user/melanie/
There are links to everything from there.
Okay, I'm hitting the pavement. Thank y'all for
your time.
Host Dunc_FmExec:
We have a link to her web sight on the top level
of the forum. I'll also place on in the links folder too! Great sights
she has! :)
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